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[Music]  [Music]  you  good morning everyone and thank you  everyone for actually being here today  to share my passion for marine  electrical and electronics of course on  boats we had a really good day yesterday  so for some of you that were here  yesterday you're gonna have a little bit  more insight and what we're talking  about but the feeling of being lost with  electrical is commonplace to everyone  all the time so yesterday I was speaking  with a few people after the course and I  think it's one of those things where  marine electrical and I can speak just  for myself I don't think I will ever  truly know everything about anything and  so what it is it's just a journey it's  not about getting to completion it's  about simply finding out and learning  more about your boat so at times it's ok  to feel like yeah I got this oh I  learned here all right this doesn't make  sense when I read electrical systems  I'm also lost and I'm like ok first time  it doesn't make too much sense and then  I read it again maybe 6 months later and  I'm like oh okay and then you figure it  out and then things start because it's a  concept and it needs to kind of come  together and so the feeling of being  overwhelmed with a boat in general and  electrical specifically is normal and  that's just part of the fun so I just  want to emphasize that's what we're  gonna be talking about overall today and  don't be too disappointed if things  don't all make sense right the first  time so today the topic is going to be  electrical and electronics fundamentals  and it's gonna relay relay to what we're  gonna try to figure out is how do you  troubleshoot those systems on your boat  so that's what we're gonna be talking  about before we get started want to  emphasize please cell phones if you can  make sure they're on mute that'd be  great  ask questions I'm gonna emphasize and  this is gonna be a little bit there's  going to be more questions in this  section because a lot of it is kind of  figuring out what's going on so feel  free to lift your hand if it's the right  time I'll tell you or maybe I'll take it  for later takes lots of notes and then  as I mentioned yesterday  all these slides are gonna be actually  provided online so you're gonna be able  to access these resources later on for  the people that are joining us here  today a little bit about myself  wondering why I'm here talking to you  about marine electrical is it because I  own a boat or I've voted before I think  it's a little bit more than that I've  dedicated my life really it's it's a  full commitment to marine electrical  systems that's all I do 16 hours a day I  breathe that's it I'm a complete nut for  making a boat systems reliable and  hopefully today you're gonna see through  that the passion that I have in actually  converting reliability to having a good  time on the water so that when you're  actually on the water you're there to  enjoy it and you're not constantly  dealing with the problems of having to  figure out why your systems are failing  and things don't work a big part of  doing work on a boat is understanding  that you don't want to do things on your  own and do it your own way there are  codes out there and I am a strong  believer in actually doing things the  right way the first time and maybe you  think you have a better way but I would  really question and ask everyone to  really consider the code and to do  things as the code that stipulates and  to not invent their own way of doing  marina electrical which I find  interesting every day on boats I see it  all the time but the code is there  probably a really good benchmark to how  to approach marine electrical and  electronic systems all right so a little  bit about the company  we're basically focused and we're or  developing our expertise Pacific yacht  systems through expertise through  repetition that's sort of my mantra you  only get good at something if you do it  over and over again so that's a big  thing we work here in the Lower Mainland  and Sunshine Coast and Vancouver Island  so we have technicians in all those  three areas and a big part of our  business now is actually doing design  consulting services for boaters around  the world that's probably about 20% of  our business now where people hire us to  consult and provide  or a sounding board there's kind of  dreaming about what they want to do with  their boats and they're like thinking oh  well how am I going to do this I'm not  sure and they've read a lot of on blogs  but now they want to have a one-on-one  conversation with someone and so we'll  pair them I pair them up either with  myself or some of my senior engineers  and then they can start narrowing down  their choices of what they're gonna  actually achieve with their boat or the  improvements they're gonna do on their  boats and to give you an idea just last  year alone or this year we did over a  thousand boats so that gives you kind of  the breadth and that's what I'm going to  be trying to share to you today is sort  of like we can worry about a lot of  things when we troubleshoot but there  are you know in terms of probabilities  more probable things that have failed  when something's not working so it's not  about looking at everything you start  with the most probable and then you go  down the list right and you get that  experience or that knowledge by actually  getting invited on both all the time to  fix a problem and that's really what I'm  going to be sharing about today and if  you're curious and you're still thirsty  and you want to geek out and you want  more information about mode electrical  systems or electronics I invite you to  go to the website or our YouTube channel  we have a lot of other content related  to what I'm talking about here today so  it's worth rehashing that when you work  on electrical systems there is a it's  not like building a table there are  certain elements of safety and so you  want to be a little bit cognizant of  those safety factors right so  electricity can cause fires it's a real  - threat and that's mostly how boat  fires happen is through electricity  right or problems on the electrical  systems work within your confidence  level don't just kind of like and your  competence level is something that's  growing right like I have for example  this border that I know has no technical  background so whatsoever none he's an  accountant and he does tremendously good  work but he also educates himself does  everything himself I've never worked on  his boat I just provide advice and we're  talking and he gets it but he's also  very thirsty for knowledge he's  constantly educating himself reading  blogs reading articles and then when he  does something he does it well so it's  not about what your  your past history is if you have an  interest in something I think anyone can  do very well and anything that they  apply themselves to and so work within  your confidence level means just don't  simply go there and do it  educate yourself read about it figure  out ask the pros ask other boaters how  they've done it and then tackle the  problem as opposed to just get in there  and just try to hash it out and then I'm  reiterating about a Bui C and M ei is  very important there are standards out  there the codes are well there's two  ways there's 11 as a B Y C NMEA has so  let me talk about the codes they're dry  right so for example what you would do  is you would need almost sort of like  when you talk about law you meet or talk  to a lawyer that sort of brings in down  to a simple way for you to understand so  like so for example when I was reading  the Coast prior to me getting into them  I was reading them through other authors  so authors would summarize the codes and  make it in a way that I could easily  understand right because it you need  sort of a translator because when you  read the code this is not a novel right  this is this is far from it it's very  bullet driven you know it's it's it can  be overwhelming so what you do is you  read from authors who are only doing  work based on the codes like someone  like knowledge nigel Calder for example  right and then he'll synthesize that  information and presented to you in a  way that is readily available and he  might even I try to do sometimes with  voters he might tell you the why because  a lot of people what I find is it's hard  for people to just be told what to do  but if they understand why they're doing  it then they're more likely to do it  it's the same thing that I do with our  technicians on our team I never tell  them what to do I tell them why we're  doing something as long as you tell them  why we're doing something then the what  normally follows the problem is the code  Kant doesn't have any background to why  they're telling you what  telling you and then you see any well  that's just stupid because you don't  have context and so that's the challenge  with reading the code per se is that  there is no context to a code they don't  tell you any wise it's do this and so I  would say that when if you want to  follow the code the easy way to do it is  read from really like Don Casey  whoever there's people that do really  really good work and they're translating  the code and making it accessible for  everyday people but if you want to dig  in a B YC e 11 is a really good way and  NMEA has different standards we'll talk  about that there's zero 100 200 300 400  our technicians go through training so  these organizations will actually come  down to Vancouver they'll come to the  island they'll come to Seattle I  remember when I did my electrical  certification I went down to Seattle for  five days or four days so then there's  instructors that kind of bring that but  again we're not studying from the book  because the book is it's just  instructions very hard to understand  you've got a book that actually  synthesizes that information puts it  with context and then you learn the code  the point that I always emphasize and I  try to live by and our team does and I  is to do it right don't make it work on  about reliability is everything you're  gonna depend on it if something is there  you're gonna assume it's gonna be there  when you need it you want to remove as  much variability on your boat in  surprises and by doing it right doing it  properly the first time you're not going  to be constantly disappointed with your  both electrical systems or electronic  systems where they're intermittent and  nothing is more bothersome than a  problem that comes and goes and if it  doesn't bother you I can guarantee you  it will bra bother someone on your crew  there's going to be someone on that boat  that will hate that something works  sometimes and it doesn't work other  times so we're gonna start the morning  with two things we're gonna do a little  bit on electrical fundamentals because  that's going to help you for  troubleshooting and then we're going to  even at a higher level on the  electronics talking about the what and  then we're gonna dive in to  troubleshooting both of them probably in  the afternoon so I don't want to scare  people here but we're just gonna try to  make sense because power or connectivity  is really generally the issue with most  devices meaning besides a product  failure a lot of times the issues are  connectivity problems between those  devices on your boat they're lacking  power they're not getting the  information they need those connectivity  issues relate to electrical fundamentals  or networking and we'll talk about  networking a little bit later so the  water analogy is an incredibly great way  to think or imagine what a volt is  ultimately it's about potential and it's  actually used interchangeably right  what's the potential and think about  with a dam the height of the water  behind a dam determines how fast the  turma  turbine at the bottom of the dam is  going to turn right the deeper you dive  into a swimming pool the more it hurts  your eardrums there's the weight of this  water column above you is bigger and  bigger the deeper you go and so volts is  simply about potential and this slide  demonstrates that something at 12 volts  is gonna have more potential power than  at 1.5 volts and think about 120 volts  right so the higher the potential the  more power you can have all right to  move that turbine so very similar to  water pressure it really is very very  similar and when I think about batteries  and I think about batteries at different  voltage levels I'm literally thinking  about batteries that are putting put in  parallel between different pools of  water or tanks of water that are  actually joined together you know what  happened  when you join two tanks of water that  are uneven well the pipe that's  connecting the both is gonna see an  inrush of water too even the two tanks  out right and so that is happens with  electricity and if you think about that  electricity is a little bit like water  then what it makes you realize is it's  pretty deterministic right it's not that  magical like if you have you know some  places have pretty intricate complicated  plumbing like they've got things going  everywhere are you thinking about maybe  a refinery or a chemical processing  plant it's not just like the pipes in  your home it doesn't just it's not that  simple but at the end of the day it's  free it's not magic if it's done right  at the beginning all everything is  properly interconnected and done like a  pro it's gonna work so the water analogy  is a way to make yourself realize that  this is not that hard it really isn't  and it it's good to think in those terms  whenever you think about electricity so  we talked about voltage though the next  thing you want to think about is okay  well what about what's this thing about  resistance like why does resistance  matter  well resistance in here is think about  if this is a pipe what happens when you  kink a pipe right and you think about  even washing your deck on your boat and  you don't have a nozzle and you put your  finger at the end of the nozzle right  the water because it's going through a  smaller opening is gonna come out faster  right there's gonna be a restriction  right and so again a kink right so what  would happen so resistance is something  that actually is going to affect and  it's going to have an infect on voltage  drop and we'll talk about that and it's  very important because when you have a  bad connection and we see that boats  that even have partially sunk or even  think about you know in an engine room  where maybe a water hose got undone from  your impeller and sprayed salt water in  the engine room and the ensuing  corrosion prob  so you have in your engine room where  things are now intermittent you know  when that water spewing in the engine  room it might be going on the inverter  it might be going in different places it  might be going on the starter post might  be going on the starter at the  alternator and over time you have these  complications where things aren't  working well well that's because now you  have corrosion and through corrosion  you're gonna have voltage drop so  putting it through a small pipe is sort  of like a small filament right it's  changing the wire size we talked  yesterday we saw the difference about  running you know amperage through a  large wire and through a small wire and  if fuse is simply a device that at one  point when you exceed the ability of  filament you exceed the average rating  of that fuse that wire filament is  simply going to blow it's gonna melt so  that you don't lose the wire itself you  just lose the fuse so a light bulb has a  filament all right so don't be scared  current which is known as I in the  engineering world is voltage over  resistance so abs is volts or amps om  semi all right so let's take an example  here you've got a 12 volt battery right  and you've got a 2 ohms resistance how  many amps are going to be flowing  through that circuit and I want to funny  it took me a long time I didn't even  really get it in engineering it's  incredible like some concepts they're  almost like that Eureka moment where  you're like oh my god I got it the  resistance here is the very thing that  stops this circuit from being a short  circuit if you remove the light bulb  from this circuit and you have nothing  other than a wire and a wire does have a  resistance but very little you're  creating a short circuit so it's it's  essential for all circuits to have a  load you can't simply connect a positive  and negative wire together and not  expect to  in ensuing fire because there's no way  to limit the current going through the  wire the resistance the load is what  actually limits the amount of current  going through that cable or wire so it  is in this instance you've got six amps  going through that circuit okay you're  never going to be doing those  calculations on your boat what you want  to think about and I see this commonly  that what the takeaway here is that  every single piece of equipment  electrical equipment on your boat is  essential to limit a dead short from the  power supply you cannot ever ever ever  connect a positive and negative wire  together without something in between  that provides a limiting factor so that  you don't have a dead short between  positive and negative okay but I'm not  seeing myself doing amp calculations  when I'm troubleshooting I'm using this  as an example to remember that there is  going to be current going through a wire  because that's going to be really useful  and I'm gonna show about that a little  bit later on how you can see if a load  is actually working or not the other  thing that is essential is going to be  measuring voltage across two points in  this instance it says finding battery  voltage but it could be any sort of  voltage it could be a voltage between a  and B and as you're troubleshooting and  sometimes unfortunately you might be in  the middle of nowhere you might be you  know I've got calls from people all over  the place from the Browns from really  deep into desolation sound where they  can have cell reception but they just  simply can't get a technician on board  and they want to troubleshoot and so  that's where having a multimeter on  board is absolutely crucial if you want  to be self-reliant it's easy if you're  always in the city if your boat never  leaves the dock and you can afford a  technician no problem this doesn't apply  to you you'll just simply always call  the challenges you might  be able to and are willing to pay for a  technician in the city but what happens  when you're in the middle of nowhere and  you want to resolve this problem because  you don't want to either you don't want  to end your vacation or this is actually  such a big deal that it actually affects  your vacation you can't even come home  until you resolve this problem and  that's why trouble shooting is essential  it's not that you can't throw money at  it is there's no way to throw money at  it because there's no one around you  that can help you other than yourself  and it comes back to this being this  self-reliant  so what you'll end up doing is you'll  want to be able to measure potential  voltage another way that it's described  is differential right what is the  difference in volts between two points  on a circuit so here we're just  demonstrating measuring voltage  potential across a battery what happens  when you reverse the probes notice that  before the positive was the top and now  the negative so the polarity is gonna  change right between maybe if that  batteries let's say 1.5 volt it's gonna  be one point five negative one point  five right and then what happens and  this is pretty common here we're just  demonstrating a one point five battery  but how many boats have six volt golf  carts pretty common right wire it in  series two batteries wired in series and  then have another two wired in series  and another two and then have them in  parallel and if you want to know if that  battery which battery has failed you'll  most likely and this happens to boaters  all summer long remember failures are  gonna most likely happen when you're  using your boat they're not gonna happen  when you're not in your boat and you're  not gonna know a failure probably until  you use your boat and how many of us use  your boat at the dock not that many so  these problems unfortunately happen to  us  when we're on our own you've got to  figure this out and I walk through this  sort of testing with owners and boaters  all the time okay let's isolate the  battery you've got a battery bank you've  got a batteries which battery has failed  let's measure the voltage across every  battery let's find the one that has a  dead short what's going to happen next  let's start there once we figure that  out then we can isolate but you do that  by measuring in this instance the  voltage potential between one end and  the other and what voltage are you gonna  get right you're gonna get in that  instance three volts or if it was a golf  cart battery two in series it'd be 12  here's another instance how many boaters  have group 31 s or 8 DS in parallel tons  I mean I'm every searay that is out  there instead of putting an ad on board  now they're putting group 31 s because a  they wait half as much and they're  putting the batteries in parallel  because they still just need 12 volts on  the smaller boats and they're putting 2  root 31 s in parallel so replace 1.5  volts with group 31 12 and so when you  wire and you measure the voltage  potential across you're still measuring  12 volts because they're not in series  now they're in parallel the rule is this  when you add there's two variables to a  battery in terms of amp power at  characteristics there's a lot but let's  let's bring it down to two simple points  one is amp hours right that's capacity  we talked about that yesterday it's  called the C 20 rating I'm not gonna go  into that but that's what it is so you  buy a battery and capacity golf cart  battery is about 220 amp hours and then  you're gonna buy it in voltage it's six  volts it's not really but let's call it  six when you add batteries in series the  amp hours stay the same and the volts  keep adding pretty common now to see  both 24 volts right so you'll have  literally for golf cart batteries in  series four ball golf cart batteries in  series are gonna be 24 volts with it two  hundred and twenty amp hour rating so  you can't it's there's no miracle you  can't add volts and amps you either one  or the other now if you take for example  an 8 d battery or a group 31 battery  group 31 battery is a hundred and twenty  hundred and ten app hours and you start  putting them in parallel the volts stay  the same but the amp hours keep  increasing that's how you get a larger  battery bank  so for group 31s in parallel is 440 amp  hours at 12 volts the other thing that I  think is really essential as a boater if  you want to be self-reliant is to start  drawing stuff out and neatness is gonna  be key on your boat I can't tell you how  many boats I go into and I'm looking at  the battery bank and after five minutes  I'm still not sure how everything is  wired it works but our brains are  looking for patterns that's what it is  chaos is natural but order isn't and if  you have order on your boat electrically  speaking like things are done neatly and  that's why pros do it like that it's not  because they're crazy they're OCD it's  because then you if something's out of  place it will obviously stick out and  mechanics talk about this with  cleanliness is godliness on an engine  right they say how important it is to  have your engines perfectly cleaned  everything about it so if you ever see a  little bit spot of oil something looks  out of place your brain is gonna spot  the anomaly if everything looks like  chaos you could stare at it for twenty  minutes you're not sure what's new what  was there before and you're still  staring at it it doesn't make any sense  so for troubleshooting and looking at  batteries create a little schematic when  things are calm when you don't have a  problem how are my batteries wired so  that when it comes down to it you can  either take a picture of it send it to a  technician send it to a friend like I've  got a problem where do I start  and that's a great thing about the  boating community right is that you can  really rely a lot of times I'll have  voters that are middle know we're stuck  and I'm like okay you're in desolation  sound there's bound to be someone around  you that's maybe more comfortable than  you are if you're not go on a little  tender ride and find someone that's  willing to help and oddly enough I  always get to talk to someone else right  the owner the primary owner might not be  comfortable it's a  of a great he's like I can't I just I'm  not comfortable but then I'll be talking  to someone else hi Joe oh yeah so you've  been on this boat you don't know  no but I'm here to help yeah I'm pretty  good I'm a mechanic or I'm an engineer  or yeah I've built my own boat or I've  done this or I sail around the world or  whatever yeah so tell me what should I  do and then we walk through it and this  community helps and we can resolve  problems with one another even though I  might not be there in person  but a diagram is gonna make the job of  whoever is working on your boat or  helping you out much easier so batteries  in parallels right we got two 12-volt  batteries positive to positive right and  negative to negative right so what  happens to the volts 12 volts that's  right and what about the amp hours 200  yeah and that's how you get a larger  battery back right like it's pretty rare  that you're gonna have someone that's  gonna have one battery for the whole  battery bank right and think about even  a 12 volt battery is really six  batteries in series because there's no  such thing as a 12 volt cell all the  cells are two point one volts for a lead  acid battery so when you're buying a 12  volt battery you're actually buying six  batteries that are wired in series in  that battery  short-circuits it's sort of like  lighting a match in a gasoline tank that  is mostly empty full of vapors it's the  end of the world can never happen it's  game over so there's no kind of like a  whatever it's just fun no a dead a short  circuit between a positive post on a 12  volt battery we saw some videos  yesterday is extremely significant and  is it and will be a life event on your  boat you will never forget that day ever  so what we do as boaters is we try to  avoid having that right very very very  big and that's where all this safety  craziness and people call me are you  just a fuse nut I'm like I'm a fuse nut  I'm like do you wire everything in your  home right hot  you have three nails on the wall that's  it your circuit panel you like to the  electrician that you know I you don't  need that I do my style grow up three  nails on the wall just wrap wires around  it  whatever happened happens we'll just go  with it because believe it or not large  portions of boats out there have the  exact attitude that a grow-op has you  know what I'm here I want to get it done  something happens we'll deal with that  later I just want an electricity right  now don't care about a short-circuit  don't care about a fuse blowing there's  no need to think about it I don't need  one  I'm a lucky guy it's just gonna work  alright so what is a watt and that's  going to be really important so when you  think about how water tanks a windlass a  lot of devices on earth right it's the  actual rate of doing work yesterday I  was using the word energy energy stored  that's it's what is doing work energy is  storing power right  so these are good little examples a  windless 1200 watts that's a really good  one VHF radio 25 char plotters nowadays  are probably about the same 25 watts  they used to be more right so and all  these values are going to depend on what  the voltage you feed to the device right  so this big difference between and we'll  talk about that what happens when you  run a device at 24 volts or you running  at 12 volts or you run at 120 volts  right that's gonna have an impact on the  current draw so for in this instance in  the diagram we've got a 60 watt light  bulb sorry and so if you've got 60 watts  and you got a 12 volt circuit you're  gonna have a 5 amp draw make sense right  so 5 amps is gonna flow through that  wire and there's this multimeter tool  that I use was just called a clamp on  multimeter and big fan because it's  something that you don't have to  actually even use probes you can just  clamp on on any wire you know just  literally wrap it around it's almost  like wrapping your fingers around a wire  and you can actually see the current  draw that a load is giving you and  that's really useful for troubleshooting  really useful because it's not scary  you're not disconnecting anything you're  not probing and I want to know is this  device drawing any power this point is  very important the second point amps  very widely based on voltage on the  circuit running a windless with an  alternator is a good idea because your  voltage is higher therefore the amps are  gonna be less on the circuit but the  opposite is also true  and equally worse because now if you've  got your batteries are depleted 11 11  and a half and you're running the  winless with no alternator there and  you're running your windlass at 11 volts  what was good at 14 is now really bad at  11 right so you always want to have the  higher the Volt within reason  is better than a lower voltage and  that's what happens when you get to this  low volts in things start dying  alright there are implications of what  happens under low voltage that can be  pretty serious especially for motors  okay so here's a microwave that's a  common item on a lot of boats not  everyone has a microwave but it's pretty  commonplace if you've got a 1200 watt  microwave and you're running it all over  120 you're gonna have a 10 amp draw and  you know what's so interesting I get  this all the time like I'm talking not  everyday but almost Jeff you're telling  me I'm gonna put in a hundred ample  charger on my boat but I only have a 30  amp receptacle on the dock how will I  run a hundred amp charger with a 30 amp  receptacle I can't and I don't have a  generator what am I gonna do it's maybe  it's probably my fault right what I  should have said is we're going to  provide a hundred amp 12 volt charger  right that's probably gonna draw around  15 18 amps ac alright I should have told  them the whole story right because the  reality is that a load at 120 and a load  at 12 is different so you can have a lot  of devices like a Chargers a really good  example it converts AC amps to DC amp  that conversion process is not free  right it doesn't simply convert for free  so a charger is generally gonna run  about 1.8 times you'll actually if you  put a hundred amp charger on your boat  it's probably gonna draw it should you  the math you think well it's only 10 ads  right it's a factor of 12 to to 120s  factor of 10 but there's a there's a  conversion rate and that conversion is  going to draw you about 18 amps versus  what you thought would it be only 10  amps  inverters are way better newer inverters  are way better at converting DC to AC  but chargers are pretty inefficient  still so if you've got a microwave 1200  watt load 120 volts you got a 10 M so  you know probably the circuit on which  it's connected is going to be the  standard plugs that we have in the wall  like at home and that's gonna be a 15  amp receptacle right 15 amp receptacle  is gonna easily be able to handle a 10  amp load we talked about that a little  bit yesterday you rarely want to have  you'll definitely a lot of times gonna  have the windless manufacturer is going  to be very specific and to what they  want as a circuit breaker that circuit  breaker if they tell you they want 80  amps and they're not expecting 80 amps  on that windless they're saying at 80  you got to stop they gave us a safety  factor right they gave us some room so  it's not like the windless is always  like for instance this windlass is a  hundred the manufacturer would never  tell us to use a hundred amp breaker on  there never because it would nuisance  trip all the time now a lot of them are  not going to be telling you what  actually the windlass is doing they're  not even to tell you what it the amps is  drawing they're just gonna give you  specific instructions use this as a  breaker on this windlass right and  they're in their department  manufacturing they're going that's  enough within reason because the  windings on the windlass cannot handle  more than X so put a thermal circuit  breaker of X on the circuit now notice  how this winless is doing better when  the voltage is higher in terms of a  lower amp draw right that's why it's  always good when you're running your  windlass to make sure that your engine  is running but not only that to make  sure that you've engaged the throttle  enough so that your alternator excited  and it's outputting something that is  meaningful to recharge the battery and  if your  were really depleted well maybe you  should leave the alternator run for  10-15 minutes to bring the battery  voltage higher so that when the windless  does run for one minute two minutes your  amperages are less than they would be  without the alternator running if you  have a stock alternator is like ten  fifteen amps as what is the stock  alternator output at idle ten fifteen  amps maybe talk alternators 55 amps if  you have a vanilla alternator and you  didn't order a high output one you just  have an alternator nobody ever sold you  nobody ever gives you something that's  amazing without telling you it's amazing  that's the rule  nobody gives anything away oh yeah well  well it's like if you got a high output  alternator now of course if you bought a  super insane boat and you bought a four  million dollar five million dollar  flemming that's fifty five feet or  something yeah you know that the owners  went full stupid  the builders yes okay but there  everything's full stupid they went  everything what I would have done but  that's the exception right everything  else if you have a stock alternator  that's fifty five amps maybe you're  lucky you got an eighty then they go  much bigger than that and their internal  regulator we talked about that yesterday  so don't expect a lot and especially at  idle it's a function of RPM right our  alternate output for most stock  alternators are very low on low rpms but  something is better than nothing it's  not to say that it's not a lot that you  shouldn't use it put all the chances on  your side now here's another example  what happens when you run into 24 volts  notice how the amperage went down that's  pretty critical and that's why builders  are on the larger boats are going 24  volts because the distances are so long  and they want to save on the wiring and  they're like oh yeah the complications  of having 20  we'll turn that bad I'm gonna wire my  boat 24 and then we'll put dc-to-dc  converters or I'll put a small battery  bank for only 12-volt loans but the  ideal boat eventually in the future  would be definitely 24 volts the the  bigger the voltage the better it is it's  just there's not a lot of appliances  that run at that voltage in the past  more and more so now it's easier and  easier to go to higher voltages all  right so what is direct current there's  two things right we're I'm using this  word intern changeably and this is gonna  be important when you're troubleshooting  you're gonna be thinking am i dealing  with DC or AC right direct current for  the most part like ninety nine ninety  nine percent is gonna come from a  battery on our boat some of you might  have a 24 volt boat and 12 volts come  from the DC to DC converter but that's  very rare very rare only some of us have  those for the most part everything DC on  a boat is generally coming from a  battery some boats even have 32 volt  systems again pretty rare but they're  out there  solar panels output DC current  alternators up with DC current we talked  about wind generators up with that DC  generators we talked about output DC  obviously an AC generator does an output  DC the primary use of an AC generator is  to output AC current we'll talk about  what AC current is and that's  alternating current the AC is what we  see in our homes right I mean that's  what it is it's ubiquitous you get it  from shore power or running a generator  right or you can get it from an inverter  right an inverter will provide AC so on  your boat there's really three only ways  for you to generate AC I mean there's  always exceptions but like you're  connected shore power AC you're running  a generator  an AC generator or you've got an  inverter and you're creating AC from DC  but those are the three methods on how  you're gonna get alternating current  power supply and what are a see  yesterday I wanted to emphasize what our  AC lows on your boat AC loads are  outlets right those plugins it might be  a microwave it might be a hot water tank  a battery charger is gonna have an AC  input it could be an AC water maker it  could be a AC garbage compactor  it could be air conditioning some boats  a lot of boats actually come with air  conditioning we don't use them that much  here but they'll come with air  conditioning air conditioning AC driven  right  all of those are sort of AC loads that  you have on your boat people that go  offshore we wired i'vecome compressors  AC dive compressors right generally  things that need a lot of power are  going to be driven by AC why because the  voltage are better there to 2120  that means the wiring size can be  significantly less and that's why large  loads are generally driven by  alternating current all right  so okay we're gonna we're gonna deal  into a little bit of wiring and after  that we'll take a little bit of break  and then we're gonna do into electronics  so we talked about how important working  from safe doing things the right way  I am constantly surprised and amazed  that the ability for people to innovate  in the wrong ways on their boats there's  a common way that works for 99% of the  world but there's always an owner that  is convinced that they know better than  everyone else I have rarely been  impressed positively by someone who came  up with something better than the rest  of the world does it there are very few  people that will wire a boat better than  what the code does in a unique way that  no one else thought about very rare  never I have yet to encounter it there  probably one of them out there but  that's an Edison like that's someone  that is out there completely on their  own the rest of us are looking at each  other peers and we're like what are they  doing oh yeah that's a good idea  oh yeah but they're all pros they're not  people that have wired a boat for the  first time one time and are coming up  with a better idea than someone that's  worried about 10,000 times right the  best golfers are not the people that  play golf once and they're like they're  the people that play golf every day so I  want to emphasize and here's what's  here's what's good and here's what's bad  if you have a previous owner that is  convinced that they know more than  anyone else you could be in a world of  hurt  where what appears to be what it looks  like in their mind was the exact  opposite I've been on boats where reds  are blacks blacks or reds  I've been on boat where they actually  decided that patterns are bad you should  always be on your toes so we're gonna  wire red sometimes black sometimes and  we're gonna interchange we're gonna use  AC whine for DC DC for AC we're gonna  mix it up like well you'll never know  you'll always need to think and I am not  making this stuff up I'm not making it  so as an owner of a boat 8 you'll never  do that because you're here and you're  educating yourself you're clearly not  that person but what you need to be  careful about is what about the person  before me that owned my own boat were  they that person and if they are then  shred lightly slowly because nothing is  what it seems  and that's why the code is important  because it's a waste of time I remember  on my boat I had to do that there are  things on my boat that were just amazing  it was craziness and I was so frustrated  at the beginning I was like why am i  spending all this time repairing  something that could have been done the  right the first time and actually  working on things to improve my boat as  opposed to just fixing something that  was done bad because there's a lot of  work on a boat nobody ever has to worry  and say golly gee I wish I had a  tasks to do on my boat if only I had  something that was essential and  pressing I'm coming here to boat and  I've got nothing that I could  potentially do heavy sarcasm I mean a  boat is a list if you get into it it's  it's mild deep it you could you could go  forever and you just prioritize the  important ones so my take away with  standards is don't waste your time  redoing things that could have been done  once right worried about the things that  you can't influence that you'll have to  repair and do those things frequently  the things that you don't there's so  much work on a boat there is so much  work so do things to standards ABY sees  down is g11 do it right the first time  so this is going to be for  troubleshooting very essential I've seen  this boats from the 70s that did not  have an AC panel on their boat that was  retrofitted was reference it retrofitted  at the time with solid core copper  wiring on their boat it's called a world  of hurt a world of hurt a boat unlike a  house is a vibration prone environment  now if your boat doesn't vibrate  congratulations you have a houseboat and  your boat never moves so you have less  problems but if your boat actually moves  because of engine or it goes in the seas  and you're actually in seas you're gonna  have vibration on your boat that  vibration will break those cores over  time they will and that's why you  absolutely want this sort of wire it's a  copper wire that's been tend to offset  corrosion which causes resistance and so  you want that sort of wire in your boat  now these are different wire sizes but  you can buy marine grade AC wiring like  for example that's potentially 14-3 you  can buy fourteen three cable  marine or household completely different  but very essential that you have that  wiring your builders are I've never seen  a builder built of this ever you might  have welding cabling on your boat a lot  of builders did for reasons of cost and  it's realistic it does happen it does  happen but if you're doing something on  your boat know that that is a very  short-term gain for long term pain so  when you're buying wiring and if you  have wiring that is welding cable and  you have problems of resistance on that  circuit don't be surprised right because  there's no tinning on the cable and the  cable over time will have more and more  voltage drop under load and it's going  to give you grief color codes talked  about that earlier they're there for a  reason  it's about predictability it's about  being on board and just jumping in not  having to think about every single wire  what it does it creates a pattern okay  very important here's a list I know it's  the list might be hard but there's a  common list of 12 volt wiring color  codes the slides are gonna be  presentable that would be something that  you'd want to work towards the big ones  are DC is positive is red now DC  negative is yellow thank god good reason  so that's really essential and then  you've got other different codes  well we yeah we rarely find that wires  almost doesn't ever exist can almost  never find that no yeah it's we used for  DC wiring negative we use yellow period  [Applause]  yeah yes good question how does one tell  the difference between a Seahawk which  is black and dc-  which on all of our a lot of our boats  is black now I just want you to just  think about how insane this is one is  deaf and the other one is benign it's  ground it's earth it's life  they're both black cables and one is  death and the other one is life so you  need to do as an electrician when you  see a black cable on your boat tread  cautiously right because you don't know  what it is  in the past size of wire would have  given you at least a start of indication  it's pretty rare that you're gonna have  to watt AC wiring black wire in your  boat you're not gonna see a cable that's  as big as let's say my finger that's  gonna run AC on a boat right generally a  generator might be outputting a big  generator maybe four gauge AC right  black 4 gauge that's pretty much the  threshold of reasonable because you can  run like think about an 8 gauge runs 50  amps so 4 gauge is a big gen so  generally it's the big cables are  probably DC if they're black but then  there's a world where they overlap 10  gauge 8 gauge 12 gauge 14 gauge that  world is a world of I don't know and you  got to think about it now obviously if  the wires run in a cable and it's three  colors it should be AC right like green  white black but remember the MacGyver's  that are all around us the people that  are going to a store and say well that's  stupid why would I buy two reels of 14 2  and 14 3 when I can buy one wheel of 14  and just wire everything 14-3 my vote  and I'll have spare cabling on my boat  when I need it because sometimes I'll  use it for DC I'll use it for AC and  I'll remember that white is red black is  negative but depends things on context  and ah it's a big deal  I don't remember that forever and  somehow I'll pass that information on to  the next owner just by touch and they'll  know everything I know  yeah so I can tell you there are  countless boats that are wired 14 3 AC  cabling and they're running DC loads and  then that makes your world completely  crazy if you have a new boat or boat  that's factory main and nobody's touched  it congratulations  you don't have this problem the problem  only happens with previous owners people  that simply are infused with knowledge  people that simply were born and they  knew everything and those people don't  need to read anything about anything  so they just do it and it makes  distinguishing between AC and DC very  very hard very hard polarity also  matters I cannot say how polarity  matters polarity for example if you  screw up the polarity on the solar panel  you will blow it up some solar panels  are $1,800 that is a expensive mistake a  bilge pump if you a motor a fan if you  reverse the polarity it's gonna run the  other way that matters so polarity  absolutely matters here are some  examples for DC right this is we never  use black ever ever on DC wine ever  why would I confuse people I mean I'm  not mean I want to make people's life  easy I use yellow all the spools we buy  are yellow for DC every single one  oh yeah absolutely yeah question was do  I do that with battery cables absolutely  too hot for OTT three OTT all those DC  whine large cable sizes I use yellow  here's basically the common three colors  for AC on a boat you also on both I have  220 you'll has also red what red can  also be AC yeah  yes so if you've got a 220 boat you'll  have red black white and green on AC and  if it's a 220 boat that means it's a big  boat it's a big boat that means you have  a big generator if you have a big  generator that means you have big red  wiring so now you've got big Reds that  are actually 220 and you have Reds that  are 12 now 220 would hurt like now  that's a real life event so this is  where when you're working on your boat I  would strongly suggest that you remove  AC appliances or a seal of AC sources of  power when even you're working on your  DC system right you want to remove any  sort of possibility shut down the shore  power you know disabled at the same  inverter with the inverters service  disconnect make sure your generator  won't start and then do it but do it  cautiously because remember the  implications about 120 it's not about  pain right it's about death right you  literally can get electrocuted and it's  not that you'll not you'll be dead it's  not only gonna have a big burn mark on  your fingers or across you know if you  are kit through your body right it's not  like your fingers are gone this is not  like it's not gonna damage your body  that bad it's your heart so that's why  you need to worry about 120 it's this  alternating current that screws up with  your heart rhythm okay different wire  sizes of course this is non-metric so  the technicians that come to us from  Austria that live in where things are  actually normal and metric don't  understand any of our wire sizes  naturally I love this it's only the  British only the British they figured  out that the largest cable size was  going to be zero  so they decided largest was going to be  zero but then one time they realized  well actually it's not so I need a  bigger one  so they did one ought to wat three aught  for ott because if you said the largest  cable to be the start what is largest at  a moment might not be largest forever  smaller should have been the way they  did it which is how the metric system  works they go the smallest to whatever  it is they start from zero and build up  the imperial system does it the other  way they go from largest first and then  zero one two three four five six as you  go up bigger the number the smaller the  gauge on a boat for troubleshooting  electrical electronics and stuff like  that appliances you're going to see wire  gauges from here to about 22 this range  here 24 26 28 is so tiny you can even  it's a hair I mean it's tiny but 10  gauge 14 16 18 those are kind of the  common sizes for electronics on  electrical you're gonna start being  bigger cable sizes obviously thicker  wire carry more ants we we emphasized  yesterday how to small of the wire can  cause a fire and this is a wire that's  catching on fire and it's actually  probably just a micro shot because the  amount of smoke that comes out of and we  saw that yesterday in a video the amount  of smoke that comes out of the jacket of  a cable when it's dead short is  absolutely terrifying it is like a smoke  grenade you'll never see through it same  thing is gonna happen  I mean you you're gonna wire a dead  shorts a dead short that the challenge  is is are there differences between a 24  volts or a 12 volt dead short there's  more energy capacity in a 24 volt bank  but then the wire size is also generally  are going to be size a little bit less  so there's maybe gonna be less shielding  that's gonna the problems done them wire  melting  it's the heat that's generated when the  wire melts because the wire will melt it  will actually most likely actually melt  away you'll melt the metal apart so can  you imagine you're actually melting  copper so it actually becomes apart I  mean that's a lot of heat but in the  process it's so warm that it warms  everything around it like when we do we  do a lot of insurance claims where we  come on morning and then that bundle  wires shorts the other wires around it  because how many wires on your boat are  running alone alone in one conduit just  by themselves they're not they're  running down pipes conduits and when you  have a dead short even on a small wire  I've had that on a boat where you had a  dead short from the bridge down to Laura  helm on a small wire I think it was a  VHF cable gage 16 that short was going  down the pipe that was connecting the  two house then it caused shorts on  bigger cables which caused short and the  whole bundle shorted so it has a domino  effect right because the cable doesn't  just lie on the ground all by itself on  a completely you know concrete floor and  it just shorts and you just lose it it's  not a fuse like you see in the movies  when they blow up a bridge like you're  blowing up a wire in a bundle and that  bundle is not meant to sense a wire  that's around it getting so hot that  it's going to meal not only their jacket  but the jackets around it and then  everything just goes  so when and that could be a problem on  your boat when you're troubleshooting  and remember what I was saying a little  bit yesterday and I want to emphasize  this this is what I think is so in some  ways terrifying of being a boat owner is  that the realization that things on your  boat are not necessarily done right as  opposed to your car you know when I  started owning my boat I thought Jeff  what you're just gonna do if you don't  understand something you're just gonna  redo it the way it was done because it's  probably done right to begin with just  redo what's there and you're good to go  I can only tell you the downward spiral  that I went into this black hole when I  realized that things on my boat weren't  done right in the first place and that's  why things were not working now that is  disconcerting because then where do you  start and this is how I got into this  business  clearly I didn't want to be in this  business I wanted I was doing quite well  having a normal life working a  nine-to-five a hard job  just dealing with other stuff and going  home in the evening and boating but I  was like this is crazy things have to  work on a boat and so when you're  thinking and you're troubleshooting a  problem on your boat and your bilge pump  is constantly blowing or your water  pumps are not are failing prematurely or  why is my windlass being changed every  two years or three years why my starter  constantly dying it might have to do  that the wire feeding that device was  undersized to begin with so when you're  troubleshooting something don't assume  the problem is only that device maybe  the power feeding into that device was  undersized to begin with and you're  constantly having voltage drop and that  voltage drop is causing the appliance to  work harder than it should and it's  causing it to die prematurely this is a  blue sees and it did a good job because  a byc has a table but they've kind of  married both a wire and  and voltage table together and the  voltage that you're trying to shoot for  is either ten percent or three percent  that's called voltage drop and this is  the length of the cable return meaning  what is gonna be the cable going to  someplace and back can I tell you how  many motors are just always thinking  what's the distance between my batteries  in the windless 20 feet 30 feet okay and  then they go and they wire this I'm like  no no that's half the circuit it's 30  feet to 30 feet back it's a 60 foot run  right and also think that the distance  is the wire distance not the distance if  a laser was sent through all objects  between here and there rarely will you  ever have distances on boats can be  absurd going from the battery to a  windlass might be 30 feet if you were  like a bee and you were able to fly  through walls but the run might be 45  feet 48 feet just to go because you've  got an up down sideways across right  there's all these obstructions to get to  the windlass so that length of cable is  here and then you've got to decide is  this a non-critical load or a critical  load a byc has all these distinctions  between the two and then once you know  that then you can start choosing what  wire size you will have notice for odd  is over here and then it goes all the  way to engage 16 so here's an example if  you've got an anchor light that's 5 amps  at the top now obviously this is not an  LED anchor light this is a huge anchor  light but let's just keep 5 amps most of  them are probably 2 to 3 but let's  assume it's 5 so you got the length of  the cable to the bottom of the masts up  the mast back down and back back again  right so you got 10 plus 40 and then  another 40 plus 10 for a total of a  hundred now this is also assuming like  it's a straight line right remember very  few things there's that's why people  hide wires you don't want to see wires  in your boat so ever  hiding behind walls underneath so the  runs are not that clean so if you've got  a hundred foot run of cabling and that's  not crazy right that's not crazy 40-foot  high mass is a pretty low mass they get  much higher than that what where are you  gonna find that on the chart right so  you go non-critical load  30 feet that would give you 12 right  hundred feet but we're not doing 30 here  right we're doing this one so it's a 12  gauge and that's generally what they are  leave it on my calendar had that they  got that right we talked yesterday I'm  gonna go through this a little bit I  fused the purpose of a fuse and when  you're gonna be troubleshooting fuses  are one of the number one things you're  looking for okay if you don't know where  a fuse for a circuit is prepare yourself  for a lot of frustration when you're  troubleshooting something if you have a  power problem to an appliance the most  likely culprit is the fuse most likely  copper it is the fuse so you need to  know where the fuses are so that you can  actually replace the fuse so that you  can get the appliance working again  different example of fuses these are  kind of called ATO ATC's right you see  those in cars all the time that's a  glass fuse that's what's called an a an  elf use testing fuses on the glass ones  it's actually sometimes hard they're so  hard I mean you know you can actually  what you do is you take a multimeter and  you put it in what's called ohms test  right or continuing test and you'll  actually measure across that and before  you actually measure continuing you  actually put the two probes together and  you should hear a beep that tells you  that you're you're in their homes meter  mode you touch you hear beat that means  you've got a dead short that's what  you're looking for right because the  fuse is supposed to provide connectivity  so when you put it at the end of the  fuse if you don't hear a beep you know  you have an open circuit therefore the  fuse has blown some fuses like a class-d  fuse on inverter you can't see the  filament inside the only way to test a  Class C fuse is  the multimeter again if you don't if you  never leave the dock this doesn't matter  but if you do leave the dock and you go  further and further afield I cannot tell  you how many times I have this  conversation every day in the summer  helping other boaters figuring out why  their inverter charger is not working  I mean it's 20 30 40 times a day a week  constantly I get text messages at night  in the morning oh my god my inverter  doesn't work how do we resolve it I've  heard can you help us we don't know each  other but I heard you can help me I'm  like okay let's walk through it what's  going on  let's where's your fuse I don't know  well that's the first thing you got to  start chase the wire down it's gonna be  close to inverter oh I don't see it well  look at the positive wire and start  chasing it down rule number one create  diagrams does it you don't need it we  were being prepared is about when things  happen to resolve them expediently right  so know where the fuse is okay now  you're gonna shut off the switch you  have a switch no okay well that's a  problem all right so this is gonna spark  a little bit here okay so take out the  fuse all right you have a multimeter no  well you need one go get one I don't  have one see a friend find someone in  the marina some someone in the Anchorage  we gotta find the ohms is it dead should  you have a spare No  well that's a problem carry spares all  these things and the difference between  the person that's prepared and the  person that isn't is there's one person  that spends a day two days resolving a  problem and the other one takes  literally ten minutes so it really  depends as a boater is like do I value  my time really that's what it comes down  to and being prepared and having a  multimeter and actually before you put a  fuse just test it just for the fun of it  you know it's sort of like radar I use  radar when I don't need it so that when  I need it I know how to use it don't  have your multimeter stacked so deep in  your toolbox that you've never seen it  before and the first day you use it you  don't even know if it has batteries or  if it's powered right the problem like I  was trying to emphasize is some fuses  you cannot see the filament and the  filament is so small to begin with I've  seen glass fuses where the filament  explodes but it explodes  perfectly on the glass and the filament  is right there you're looking at it but  it actually didn't break in the middle  it braked at both ends and the filament  almost etched itself on the glass so  when you look at the fuse you're like I  still have a filament in there but it's  actually an optical effect the filament  is not there  the wire is so small within that that it  actually is an open circuit so sometimes  looking at something will not tell you  the whole story yesterday we had  questions about different types of fuses  this is with the perfect slide again  blue C's does a great job at this you  can see all the different types of fuses  here that are common for in the Mirena  environment strongly suggest that as you  go further and further afield you start  carrying spare fuses your goal should be  for everything but at least for the  critical things on your vote like an  inverter charger that goes you not only  lose your inverter which you might mean  you lose your refrigerator which this  could be a big deal because that means  you haven't all your food is going to  top so have a spare class t fuse on  board some motors I give to they're  going up to the Browns they'll never use  them but I'm like at least because if  you need a fuse in the Browns  you're not gonna get one it's not gonna  happen you're not gonna go to shape here  walk in and go hey I'm looking for a  class T fuse 400 in no way there's no  way you're on your own you're totally on  your own so this is a great chart lucy's  did a great job this shows the different  ranges we pretty much use every single  fuse on there every single one in our  business fuses are built for a purpose  they all have different trip rates  different averages and yeah they're it's  great it's awesome and even show all the  wire gauge sizes whoever made this chart  so awesome great job  well it depends like for example a  really popular one that we love and we  use quite a lot is this one here because  it's easy to install the M RBF that's  probably the most popular one that we  use now marine rated battery fuse that's  probably the number one it looks like a  chiclet it's about maybe one centimeter  you have some on your boat I put I mean  I buy these like in thousands like like  I'm crazy for fuses right crazy for  fuses  i fuse everything everything is fuse so  is your house though by the way right  like if you didn't assert it on your  house it's criminal negligence like on  the water it's a choice oh well I didn't  think I needed one because the code on  land is have to do it regardless of who  you are there's someone that comes  behind you to audit the work you did but  on a boat it's recommended so Wild West  it's the western frontier so that's why  the craziness happens in Australia this  is why I like hiring Aussies it's not  land and waters the same so over there  there is no craziness all this time that  I'm wasting talking about fuses nobody  would ever talk about it over there  because they all do it the right way  right away there is no option you cannot  not do it the proper way but in Canada  in the United States it's seen as a  voluntary recommendation so the M RBF is  probably the most popular inverters we  use this and then als we use on large  circuits a lot circuit breakers are very  similar right the fuses but the OP they  offer most of them and their thermal  circuit the ability to be reset or also  to be turned off so our AC panels and a  DC panels our thermal circuit breakers  that you turn on and off thermal circuit  breakers will die they don't want  forever they will at one point stop  working I see them it's part of and  we'll talk about how you troubleshoot  that but they will die right but they're  great because not only is it a fuse  it's a resettable fuse and it's a switch  it's a way for a boater to say I want to  disconnect a circuit all our panels are  built with these right you don't see the  back but you see that just a little  toggle white toggle and you're turning  on water pumps radar all those circuits  are basically thermal circuit breakers  that in the event of a short or over  current would actually trip so they'll  actually go on the off position in the  event of overcurrent yeah yeah yeah  Lucy's make stuns yeah absolutely the  really popular one that you see a lot of  times that you put on all pretty much  inverter on all windless is those sort  of fuses right now your circuit breakers  right you've got to press the button  right it resets if you want to close it  so for example it's great because if  your passage making and you're a sailor  and you're gonna be sailing for 20 days  between here and there you might want to  disable your windlass like why would  your windlass be powered for 20 days in  the bow of the boat that's gonna be  underwater  you might what say you know what I'm not  gonna have power on my windlass and on  my windlass solenoid I don't want to  have any accidental not only is your  anchor tied but you don't want the motor  to turn on for whatever reason so you  don't have nestle a switch for the  circuit you have a thermal circuit  breaker that you go and disable so I  remember when I sailed around Vancouver  Island and I left Port Hardy and we were  sailing around Cape Scott and I had her  horror stories and by the way for me  they were real it was a it was an  extremely humbling event before I did  that passage reading people that had  done blue water I'm like well this is  sort of gonna be my first blue water  there's probably gonna be some green  waves on the bow probably that's what I  heard not everyone has this experience I  certainly did did and so before I went  I'm like I'm not planning on anchoring  off Cape Scott not gonna happen  I like we were there a lot of us were  good swimmers I like but the shoreline  is far from inviting so it's like you  can make it to shore but you'll probably  landing on shore I was like no we're not  going to be anchoring so I disabled my  windlass as always doing that passage  and that's great that's what's nice  about a circuit breaker right you can  actually turn devices off so it's a fuse  and it's a circuit breaker all right so  with that I'm gonna just ask any  questions we're gonna about take a break  and then we're gonna go into electronics  any questions on wire sizes circuit  breakers fundamentals volts DC AC  anything no go ahead  question is if something requires 16  gauge does it hurt to have 14 gauge  absolutely not  and I can tell you as a boater it as a  technician when I wire my own boat guess  where an engineer goes does the minimum  or airs on the side of caution my wire  sizes are never to minimum never why the  cost is so tiny the the most expensive  thing on your boat is time your time or  another person's time the labor cost is  what is the biggest proportion run a  wire run once do it well do to a  slightly bigger gauge I'm not saying if  they need 16 go to walk but how many  times I don't ever run 16 I don't even  have 16 gauge all our wires are the  bigger size it's 14 16 14 12 10 10 I'm  always going to go up a size if I can  fit it on the terminal give myself room  why not it's not a lot more money and  then just do it right do it once  question I will do that  so the question was about fire fly  batters we talked a lot about fire fly  batteries yesterday I will take that  offline and we'll talk about that a  little bit later  keep it on topic right now any other  questions yes go ahead yeah a first  multimeter if you want to learn I was so  excited when I bought my boat I was it  was a combination of it was a life event  and I went to Home Depot and I bought  like 2,000 worth of dollars of tools I  thought it was justified I was like mom  I have a boat now so I need tools and I  went to Home Depot and I bought a  multimeter all of it well  all right away the multimeter is now on  a shelf and it's a reminder and I keep  it right there always to remind me that  I need to educate myself before I buy  something that multimeter is only for AC  it doesn't do DC because at Home Depot  how many people worry about DC Circuit's  so the lesson is educate yourself and I  keep it it's still there people at the  office like why do we have this here  it's to remind each and every one of us  to educate ourselves before we purchase  anything all right so you're gonna want  a multimeter that is DC enabled that's  really going to be the most of the  troubleshooting that you're gonna do  you're gonna do on your boat you're  gonna want a multimeter I'll bring one  in that is clamp on right it has it like  a sort of like a little spring-loaded  jaw and I'll bring it in I have it in  the car where you can actually measure  current on all these circuits without  disconnecting electrocuting yourself it  actually measures it through magnetic  flux right so there's a magnetic field  through every wire when current flows  through it it's just that's part of it  and so you put that little clamp on  meter and you can actually measure and I  get owners that totally geek out with me  they're like oh my god I spend the whole  weekend figuring out what my amp drawers  are and they're measuring everything all  my fridge drawers is my s bars doing  this or my windless drawers that oh my  god my thrusters drunk so much or and  then they're creating lists and they're  like I had no idea because now suddenly  you can actually know what each  individual circuit on your boat is  drawing  and that might sound a little bit geeky  when you don't need to but I can tell  you when things are gonna actually fail  knowing how to use a clamp-on meter and  you might not know perfectly how to do  all the steps but if you know how to use  the tool and you can have someone guide  you remotely to solve a problem that's  going to be really helpful again it's  all about staying on your vacation  staying on the water not having to have  someone come over to you and I do fly  technicians out but it is expensive you  don't want that you want to be  self-reliant right do everything you can  to resolve a problem and that multimeter  would be really amazing blue C's does a  really good one actually you don't have  to buy a fluke fluke is sort of like the  murse madam the best but my technicians  will some of the will spend one of my  technicians bought himself for Christmas  a $2,000 multimeter but I mean this  thing has reporting it has data logging  and I'm so envious I'm trying to justify  to myself but I don't work on the tools  anymore so I can't but for most of us  you go on Amazon and you're probably  gonna spend for a reasonable digital  multimeter not an analog one never  analog don't bother it's a waste of time  probably a hundred two hundred dollars  think about how expensive to have  someone come and help you per hour  versus having that you'll pay that  multimeter easily within the hour and  then you can have someone like myself or  someone that works on your boat help you  diagnose diagnose a problem remotely  right very helpful yes well we buy  everything at bulk crazy volume so yeah  retail well there's not that many more  chandri's right so I think you'd have to  go to your channel yeah it's got to be a  marine channel Larry so it would be like  some orders especially for sailboats  some they'll come to us our prices are  as competitive but we're not a retail  shop you're not going to be looking at  spools like we've got a front end but  the back end is 95 percent of our  business there is no retail store in our  business but they'll come in let's say I  need this and this if you want to have a  retailer  experience while in Vancouver you'll  probably end up going to Steveston West  marine went out is no longer here  there's Martin marine is awesome on the  North Shore any other suggestions I mean  oh yeah decide to Shelter Island yeah  he's great three or fourth generation  business owner guys awesome but it's  it's dwindling dwindling there's less  and less Chandler is left around right  yeah okay other questions all right  we'll take a break and then we're gonna  dive into electronics